Bro splits and why you shouldn't do them

Warpedlifter

New member

What is a bro split?

It's your typical routine that you see in magazines and that most guys in gym follow. Example

monday:chest

Tuesday: back

Etc etc essentially training each body part once a week.

Why is this bad?

Because by only training once a week you are drastically limiting growth potential and may even be losing size. Research shows muscles grow for 2 to 3 days after training. For smaller muscles like front and rear delts, biceps, forearms, this is even worse as these muscles can be trained up to 4 times a week.

The classic once a week bro split is just plain not optimal.

So what should you be doing?

We don't wanna increase volume. What you should do instead is break your current volume up into 2 separate workouts.

I hope some of you find this helpful. Proper frequency is absolutely key.

 

blastthru23

Moderator

I'll add a concept I think meshes nicely with  proper frequency, that is, fluidity. I find myself not necessarily stuck in a rut so to speak, but too comfortable in a routine plan. It's not quite as static as the "bro split" but it does eventually find stasis. One thing I'll be working on soon is designing a training strategy outside the typical 7 day week approach. Wrapping my head around that will play out but I have a fairly good idea. Anyhow, rambling...

Thanks for posting that nugget of insight by the way. Good shit :)

 
D

Dont_trip

Guest

science says one thing but bodybuilders top and mid level achieving very respectable

physiques say different, I work 1 body part a week aside from arms which i pair together, when taking anabolic protein synthesis is increased much more than2-3 days so

your advice to a natural lifter would apply but even still not everyone fits into that category some naturals take longer to recover and many many top bodybuilding coaches have their clients natural

or not

train a body part 1x a week, my advice

is try both for a decent amount of

time 3+ months.... not every peg

fits

in the same hole I have done Both and respond better to a bro split but there will

come a time I decide to change

it up. Training is not a chore

to me I enjoy it I'm in it for the long run,

my advice

to

people  is find what your body responds too bro science and science need and should

co

exist if your trying to build

an impressive physique now as far as strength goes

i would stick to science based principles

 

siegmund

Moderator

i been working 20+ years.  and i personally., grow the most. ...the last few months i been off but ...when on i am.on a 3 on 1 off and my chest is barrell and 20" arms.   ....  i find for me 3 on 1 off works the best.  i have trued every routine there is i had nothing but time.to perfect it.  ... monday chest tris heavy. shoulders light..tuesday back bis heavy. heavy shrugs  wednesday legs. next  day off friday heavy shoulders light bench. light tris. ,  next day light back pull ups light pulldowns , traps light  legs heavy.  

this works best for.me.  .. people are differnt and not everyone training.program.is for every.one i know.ppl that grow on light weight. and ppl on heavy  ..and i litterly lived in the gym 6 hours a day over 20 years.  ALL NATTY EVERYONE .,, then i seen so.e of the biggest people.just from pushups.dips.and pull ups blow your mind. ... genetics played a big part.  ... but. i seen all i also have seen ppl that train 1 body part.a week. 2 days off at the biggest.  and strenght. its person depe dent 

 

Titanings

New member

I use kind of a combination, and that seems to work well for me.

When I am off cycle I do chest, back, shoulders, guns, legs. which usually consists of 5 days on 2 days off, or can be adjusted to a split if I have something going on during the week, then I just finish my last day on the weekend. I always train each part for at least one hour of weight lifting but try not to ever go over 1 hour 20 mins.

When I am on cycle I use a 3 day on 1 off method. I pick a body part I feel is weak and try and blast it twice a week. For example I will be doing arms 2 times a week on my next cycle so it will probably look something like this: Day1-Arms, Day2-Back, Day3 chest, Day4-off, Day5-Arms, Day6-legs & forearms, Day7-Shoulders & calves, Day8-off, REPEAT.

I try and space back and legs apart since I do Deadlifts on back day, and squats on leg day. I also do calves on shoulder day since I am usually dead after leg day, and forearms between sets on leg day so I don't skip them and also forearms has nothing to do with legs so I can smash both!

I also make sure that both arms days involve different exercises, with one usually being the "heavier" day and one a "lighter" day with more reps.

 

SemperFi

Well-known member

WL opened pandoras box. Any amount of training done with the correct amount of intensity is beneficial and attempting to describe it as bad is not completely accurate. Less beneficial.... maybe. Less productive.... maybe again. Genetic disposition, intensity, supplementation and goals all play a part in choosing a routine.

I have done hundreds of different splits and schedules and I personally have found pros and cons to each and every one of them but none of them have been bad.

WL is correct that proper frequency is key but that frequency is different for everyone and even changes in the individual based on too many factors to list. Placing everyone in the same box is a sure way to get ourselves suffocated. Those that I have seen that have made tremendous strides are the out of the box thinkers using angles, mixing up frequency, staying uncomfortable, using less popular exercises, etc. Sometimes the best belief is the contrarian belief otherwise we would never see innovations or improvemenst is our chosen hobby/sport.

Training and training education is my passion (obsession is a better word) and I have found that what works for Mr. Jones is not as effective for Mr. Smith. Proper understanding of the science that is available and personal experiences are what makes this game so fun to play. We are always chasing the  pot of gold at the end of the rainbow. Personally I hope I never catch up to it..... life would be boring. ;)

I am about 60 days into a leg development cycle and I had been training legs 4 days out of 6 and calves EVERYDAY. From day 20 to day 56 I saw tremendous gains in strength and definition so I will say frequency is subjective at best.

 

SEMPER FI

 

Warpedlifter

New member

Well now I didn't say it's bad or didn't mean to imply that anyway.

What I am saying is that it isn't OPTIMAL as you are missing opportunity for growth. As far as real life experience goes......this is something I got from Mike Isreatel of RP who is a bodybuilder, professor, and works with renaissance periodization.

And hes absolutely right. I've actually met Mike in person before. He was at the last meet I did cause one of his RP athletes were completing. Super friendly guy and we talked in warm up room.

 

 

SemperFi

Well-known member

I must have completely misunderstood the context when you stated "why is this bad." ;)

Keep throwing out information brother. We all  benefit from information and good debate.

 

SEMPER FI

 

 
M

Mister A

Guest

Your body will adapt to anything. Train everything every 2-3 days for a year. Then keep everything the same, but train legs every 12 days. I would bet my gear stash that your legs would respond from the extra rest and experience accelerated growth.

Does that mean that training legs every 12 days is better than training them every 3 days? Definitely not. It just means that you've created a new variable in an otherwise static routine.

This is why HIIT type cardio works so well. Steady state, low intensity cardio is really easy to adapt to. Competitors will often be forced to eventually work up to over an hour of steady state cardio. When you do HIIT (the right way) your body never really adapts to it because it's so damn intense. So whatever is the easiest routine for your body to adapt to, is the least optimal.

Which is why it makes sense that training more frequently can lead to more gains. Your body doesn't have as much time to recover, thus it is harder to adapt to it.

This also explains why plenty of us get great gains training everything once a week. It would literally not be possible for me to train anything any more frequently than I do now. My legs are sore for about 4 days. My chest is sore for 5. So you can't just manipulate frequency, but also volume and intensity. Playing around with those three variables is a good way to experiment and find out what works well for you. I have a lot of experience with different splits as well and I find that training everything less than once a week (currently on an 8 day split) works very well for me. I'm not afraid to throw an extra rest day in there and make it a 9 day split. For me, more rest equals more growth. But no one knows if that will always be the case or of I'll need to adjust that at some point.

Great thread. 

 

Titanings

New member

Key is progressive overload....shock your body! How? Easy: More volume, more reps, supersets, dropsets, less rest between sets, More strength training, less strength training with higher reps, working body parts more times per week, more rest between working a body part, HIIT training, hitting the punching bag, all these are ways to "shock" your body and stimulate growth!

If you walk into the gym for the next 6 months doing 3 sets of 10 reps of 225 on the bench, then half way through your body is gonna laugh at you and say is that all you got?!....pussy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9zCgPtsups

 

 

Warpedlifter

New member

Mister A said:
</p><p>Your body will adapt to anything. Train everything every 2-3 days for a year. Then keep everything the same, but train legs every 12 days. I would bet my gear stash that your legs would respond from the extra rest and experience accelerated growth.</p><p>Does that mean that training legs every 12 days is better than training them every 3 days? Definitely not. It just means that you've created a new variable in an otherwise static routine.</p><p>This is why HIIT type cardio works so well. Steady state, low intensity cardio is really easy to adapt to. Competitors will often be forced to eventually work up to over an hour of steady state cardio. When you do HIIT (the right way) your body never really adapts to it because it's so damn intense. So whatever is the easiest routine for your body to adapt to, is the least optimal.</p><p>Which is why it makes sense that training more frequently can lead to more gains. Your body doesn't have as much time to recover, thus it is harder to adapt to it.</p><p>This also explains why plenty of us get great gains training everything once a week. It would literally not be possible for me to train anything any more frequently than I do now. My legs are sore for about 4 days. My chest is sore for 5. So you can't just manipulate frequency, but also volume and intensity. Playing around with those three variables is a good way to experiment and find out what works well for you. I have a lot of experience with different splits as well and I find that training everything less than once a week (currently on an 8 day split) works very well for me. I'm not afraid to throw an extra rest day in there and make it a 9 day split. For me, more rest equals more growth. But no one knows if that will always be the case or of I'll need to adjust that at some point.</p><p>Great thread. </p><p>
</p><p>The fact you still get sore is a sign of poor fitness level due to improper frequency.</p><p>With a properly designed program you will rarely get  sore.</p><p>Repeat after me. "Soreness is NOT a good indicator of growth nor is it a sign of a good workout" once an athlete is properly conditiones soreness is a NON factor.</p><p>As far as 12 days rest giving more growth....there are theories that reducing volume temporarily to "resensitize" works but it still doesn't justify poor frequency.</p><p>Also the reasoning behind this is that you are limiting growth potential and possibly even losing size by waiting so long inbewtweeb sessions. Adaptation is another issue altogether. But with proper frequency you won't get sore.</p>
 

blastthru23

Moderator

My $.02 worth, for what it's worth... there doesn't seem to be one categorical approach to training and all the ins and outs associated with it. For me, I like to switch it up, run a "program" for a bit until I'm not getting positive results, then change it up. Part of training for me is merely the pure enjoyment of it. I probably train longer per day than necessary to some, while others may have a different view. I like getting the runners high... which is the lifting high for me. My training schedule has to map on to my work schedule, and such so on some level it may be a bro split to a certain degree. But most of the "bros" at my gym well they don't progress much; typical rats.

I do my best to stay self aware with training and diet for that matter making adjustments where I see fit. Im sure there are ways to go about it unknown to me, but in time I'll discover what works. I get satisfaction from doing this more or less on my own. Someday perhaps I'll work with a trainer, I have one I'd love to work with. But, for now, I just watch, pick up things here and there and try the technique on for size. 

In my view, especially with aas, this shit can get tricky. But, that's what makes it interesting...keeps me motivated :)

 

csancheezy

New member

it make sense to progressively overload a muscle and yet it doesn't get sore during the process of repair? So you think the Olympia athletes and guys at that level  don't do all diff myriads of methods and new stuff to get there muscle sore and hit like it has never been before? nah I don't think that is true, anecdotally the people I know who are the most fit also get sore and are absolute animals in the gym, excellent conditioning and physiques, If you have stopped getting sore in some ways you have stopped pushing yourself.

 

Warpedlifter

New member

If you do something you aren't used to doing or haven't done in awhile you will get sore.

By conditioning I am referring to your body's adaptation to the type of stimulus being placed upon it. By training infrequently you LOSE your "fitness" level and become sore after training like someone new to lifting would or someone whose coming off a layoff.

Research this.........

Today I took multiple heavy singles over 90 percent on inclines did 3x6 with 80 percent and also did 2x20 on flat dumbbell with 100s....tomorrow and following day I will barely be sore.....so this means I'm not progressing?

Science doesn't back you guys up. Neither does experience in real life. Put down muscle and fitness. It's failing you.

 

csancheezy

New member

have missed the scholarly resources you sited.

And as far as anecdotal evidence many others  "real life" experiences do disagree and a few have already posted in the thread.

and i like the muscle fitness comment, cute.

 

Warpedlifter

New member

Please link me to YOUR scholarly resources and show me how I'm wrong.

Google this or read a book or ask any good strength coach. I'll wait. Prove me wrong. Don't reply unless it's something that can be intelligently discussed.

 

Warpedlifter

New member

Educate yourself. Put down muscle and fitness. Show me one reputable source saying I'm wrong? I can provide multiple supporting me. I'll wait buddy

 
Top