Intermittent Fasting

[SemperFi]

What is intermittent fasting (IF)?

• Intermittent fasting is any diet that on a regular basis restricts calorie intake for a predetermined period of time.

 Why use intermittent fasting?

• There are many benefits to IF but many of the case studies published relate to animal testing and might not be applicable to humans. As well, the benefits may be specific to the IF protocol (fasting duration) chosen which makes generalizing this style of dieting irresponsible, if not impossible. When using IF to reduce body fat it is difficult to conclude if the results are the effects of the IF protocol or the actual calorie restriction.

 So why do we use it?

• Despite the conflicts in the research there is too much real world evidence that suggests it works. This anecdote evidence is a valuable tool for us to use when the research is lacking or does not provide a clear, concise determination. In many way IF is a much more pleasant way for many in creating a energy deficit for body fat reduction and weight loss. IF also may have other benefits in regards to muscle maintenance and overall body composition.

 Who uses it?

• No diet is right for everyone and IF is no exception. Contrary to what the so-called diet ‘guru’ tells you it has nothing to do gender, age, body fat percentage or hormone levels. Other than a serious health issue or on a recommendation from a medical doctor the only two reasons that I can determine IF would not be right for a person is if they are pregnant or the individual does not like it.

Conflicting Information -

1. Skipping meals will put your body into starvation mode.

• Research says- There is no difference in energy expenditure in a 24 hour period when nibbling (many small meals) and gorging (fewer large meals). “There is no evidence that weight loss is altered by meal frequency.” - Bellisle 1997

 2. Eating smaller more frequent meals will boost your metabolism.

• Research says- Comparing 3 meals vs 6 meals per 24 hours: “We conclude that increasing meal frequency does not promote greater weight loss” - Cameron 2010

 3. Breakfast is the most important meal of the day.

• Research says- “A recommendation to include or skip breakfast had no discernible effects on weight loss in free-living adults who were attempting to lose weight.” - Dhurandhar 2014

 4. Intermittent fasting will increase cortisol.

• Research says- Comparing 1 meal vs. 3 meals in a 24 hour period- “1 meal a day led to a significant modification in body composition (fat loss) and a significant decrease in cortisol production.” - Stote 2007

 5. Intermittent fasting is catabolic.

• Research says- “Less fat free mass was lost in response to intermittent calorie restriction vs. daily calorie restriction. These findings suggest that both of the diets are equally effective in decreasing body weight and fat loss although intermittent calorie restriction may be more effective for the retention of lean mass.” - Varady 2011

 What are the risks of intermittent fasting?

• IF is skipping traditional meal times although your total daily calorie intake is the same. The same number of calories are eaten in the same 24 hour period but in a much shorter feeding window. The danger is that an individual will simply remove a meal and not make up those calories during the feeding window dropping calories too low and too quickly. 

4 key possible benefits (there are more) -

1. Less constipation than other diets


2. Appetite management


3. Muscle mass maintenance and body fat reduction


4. Decrease in insulin resistance

 

Intermittent fasting has been effective for many and there are several protocols that can be used. In fact, they are endless. If you are looking to lose weight focusing on body fat reduction then I recommend you do the research and make an educated determination to see if intermittent fasting is an option for you. Do not get your information from one single resource or look to prove your opinion by finding evidence to support your position. Anytime we are looking to make changes in our diets, training or supplementation it is important to remain cautiously open minded and find the method that makes the most sense to meet our goals.

 

SEMPER FI

 

[blastthru23]

In my limited opinion, IF is another tool one may use to achieve a fat loss goal. Often, I believe results might be based on the simple fact that one is putting in EFFORT. Personally, when I put in the effort (lets say that Effort is the application of C(M+T)=R), I experience more enjoyment of the process. When I am enjoying the process, I am not experiencing stress. Stress leads to elevated cortisol among other things, which translates into unwanted fat mass among other things. Furthermore, when I understand what the mechanisms of any given protocol are, whether its carb cycling, high volume training, stacking synergistic compounds, or simply being friendly, I find interest in the process, I want to see if I can design a program that works for me. It becomes interesting. When I am interested, I am engaged thus in the process. From such, a chemical symphony performs a suite, or an opus, bringing joy to life. This joy, will likely bring the results one is seeking. Thus, whatever protocol one uses, engage in it, understand it, go into it with interest and engagement. It's like designing and building a system to produce a result. One will always come across some element or set of elements that needs tweaked or improved. and, there is nothing more satisfying to see the system work. Blah, blah, blah

 

[SemperFi]

I agree blaster. Experience has led me to the conclusion that EVERY diet that is based on a solid method for weight loss and implemented properly is effective. It comes down to energy in and energy out. Are some more effective than others? For some people yes. The trick is to find the one that fits best for each of us and make the commitment.

Luckily for this ol' dog I don't have to diet for weight loss or body fat reduction any longer. It was a long difficult road but looking back every setback and every success was well worth the end result. I am still very partial to a ketogenic diet because for me it is so simple and I get to eat so many foods that I love... its not dieting in my mind.

 

SEMPER FI

 

[Dolf]

+3 SF another great write up!

The simple fact is that calorie restriction is calorie restriction no matter how you go about it. More calories burned than taken in equates to weight loss. If you like it and It works then go for it. For me personally this would be by far the least desirable type of diet. I get grouchy as fuck when I'm hungry. The world wouldn't be safe with me on this diet. Lol

 

[blastthru23]

And that's where one really seeks to be, that is "it's no longer a diet"

 

[blastthru23]

Wandering around the internet this morning, I stumbled across this:

https://m.medicalxpress.com/news/2017-12-intermittent-fasting-cognitive-functions-mice.html

 

[Dolf]

This post struck my intrest since I've never done this before. I've tested it out the last 2 weeks, and it seems like something I could do. I've been doing research and have seen some conflicting information. 

16/8 16 hours fasting, and 8 hours feeding seems to be the most recommended time frame and that's been what my 2 week experiment has been based on. 8pm to noon fasting, and noon to 8pm feeding. My confussion and issues are this...

Some say you can sip on amino's while others say amino's get converted to ptotein ehich removes you from the fasted state and puts you in the fed state. Which is true?

How about taking vitamins and supps like fish oil while fasting? 

3 of my training days are at 3am in the middle of my fasted state which some say your training should be after your first meal. 

 

 

[blastthru23]

I am curious about the last point you made. I was thinking that if I were to do IF, I would just make my last meal my post workout meal since it could and is argued that the body doesnt run on a 24 hour clock necessarily. So it seems one could start the fasting period at any convenient point, so long as the period is sufficient. The 16/8 may be a good jump off point, but I'm guessing there's some wiggle room. I also wonder about what constitutes a fasted state. There may be wiggle room there as well unlike the Ketogenic diet here once carbs are introduced you exited the keto-state as far I understand it... wheels are turning again

 

[Dolf]

From my research the fasted state begins 12hrs after your last meal which is why the 16/8 or 20/4 method is most recommended for ed fasting. 

The other method is 1 or 2 24hr fasted periods per week because ultimately weekly calorie deficit is more important than daily.

 

[SemperFi]

It takes me about 30-50g of carbs to drop out of ketosis. Even more if I am supplementing with glucophage. Remember their are different degrees of ketosis but even if you drop into the lower range your body is still producing ketones.

 

SEMPER FI

 

[SemperFi]

Dolf, I am going to pull some of these numbers out of my ass so don't take my opinion as gospel but consider the razor sharp reasoning.

I prefer the 16/8 over the 5/2. The first reason is I love food and the second reason is that half my fasting period is in my sleep when I can only dream about food. No sane person would deprive the self of food voluntarily for an entire day!!!

It will take approximately 30-80 NET calories for the body to break a fasting state. NET calories are the calories that remain after processing, absorbing and digesting the calories consumed. 10g of BCAA's contain 40 total calories. 1g of a typical fish oil cap contains 10 calories. I have no idea the calories lost for processing by the body but just thinking if you had 50% of net calories remaining you would still only have 25 NET calories which places you under the threshold of breaking the fast.

Agrumentitive information aside.... the benefits of muscle retention of amino acid supplementation during the fasting period in my mind outweighs the questionable possibility of breaking the fast. That is an opinion but it has worked for me.... at least while enhanced. Never did an IF natty.

I know I didn't come very close to answering your questions but I hope I added some food for thought. On top of all that our body is making NEAA's 24/7/365 as needed without loss of a fasting state.

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Ya'll stay frosty. I will be back!

 

SEMPER FI

 

 

[Dolf]

I'm experimenting with IF while trt right now up until my cycle to see if it's an option come the cut portion of my cycle. 

16/8 is my choice as well, and yes your post on personal experiences is what I am after and is very helpful. I haven't read about the calorie amounts needed to pull you out of a fadted state, and will research info/opinions on that. One person/expert said you could go as far as a very clean whey protein shake pre and post workout if your training is during the fasted state. Like anything else Internet info varies on the subject. 

 

[Dolf]

I have experimented with IF for about a month now and it seems effective and something that's doable. The hardest time is 2 hrs before my fed state begins. All I can think about is food. Lol. It's just a matter of mind over matter though. My bulk cycle has begun today, and I'm still not sure if I'll use IF as part of my cut phase, but if so I'll keep you guys updated on IF vs moderate carbs/low fat is for me personally. Combining tren and clen's appetite suppression with IF the 1hr fast should be pretty easy.

 

[SemperFi]

Here is a book you may be interested in.... Oh wait! Rangers can't read.... never mind.

https://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B075YB3GQT

 

SEMPER FI

 

[Dolf]

My qualification test was to sign my name in crayola, lick a window, and fog a mirror. I passed with flying colors! 

Looks like a good read. $8.95 is bad either!

 

[Gill-The-Gainer]

Looks like a good read. $8.95 is bad either!

 

[ImmMax]

I've tried this a few times, dont really need any weight loss and could never eat enough during my window. i prefer smaller meals that make me feel better after. i also did a 24hr one, was hard to sleep