I've been thinking about this most of the last two days. I work hard to keep increasing mass, but run out of ideas. With what I'm eating now I am crapping three times a day. I'm also seeing more food in the toilet. literally pieces of food. if it's not genetics, at what point does what I'm eating not even get used by my body because it can't keep up.
Thanks for the karma Dolf!
Sorry about the rant. issues on the home front coupled with a passion for making myself better. this topic hits home for me. like grizz said I'm always psychologically starving. trying to eat even after I finish a meal. I almost feel it's like telling a fat man "you just need to eat less man" the struggle with gaining for me must be similar to someone genetically dispositioned to keep fat. I'll always be looking for ways to improve.
Thanks again for this topic.
Mister A
Guest
You know, Ram, I cant say I didn't somewhat have you in mind while writing this. And I like the antithetical analogy you made of telling a fat person to just eat less. It really is similar. But when an obese person turns losing weight into an obsession, they see results. Same thing here. Your body can do more than you are currently thinking it can. If anyone is struggling to reach a goal it has more to do with their mind than anything else. You have a life. It's full. You're not a pro bodybuilder who can devote their existence to putting on muscle. I get it. But the first things that have to change are the limiting beliefs in your mind. Don't talk to yourself with anything less than a "Can, must, will" spirit. You can. You must. You will. Stop telling yourself you're struggling. Convince yourself that you're growing and you're doing the damn thing. If you're a guy who looks in the mirror and tears himself down and thinks you're not getting bigger, then start doing the opposite or stop looking in the mirror. Whatever the mind believes will shape the circumstances around it. I'm trying to get into the habit of closing my eyes at night and going through a mental checklist of visualizing my body growing. Bigger than it was yesterday. Harder. Leaner. Stronger. Bigger. Fucking bigger. Before I go to sleep I have to convince myself that today was a success and that I'm closer to where I want to be, not just physically, but in all aspects. If I can train my mind to believe that, then I know it will take effect.
Mister A
Guest
You said you're eating 5K a day and not gaining weight? We got an issue now. And if there's food in your shit, you're obviously not digesting food properly. What kind of food is in your shit?
And just to be thorough can you outline what a day of eating for you is like?
a workday meal plan starts with 16oz jar with half cup while milk whole cup oats half cup Greek yogurt chia seeds flax meal and hemp protein...blueberries for sweetener.
then 15oz cottage cheese and pinnacle tidbits.
270 calorie builders bar
steak burrito for lunch with guac it's 1200 calories.
two scoops protein powder. afternoon I grab a sandwich or shake from ice cream shop or bowl from noodles. try to ensure it's 1000 calories.
I'm bringing 8oz mixed nuts with me every day and eating the bag
dinner is 800-1200 meat potato veggie. finish with a protein shake 800 calorie before bed.
even on days I don't get all the way there, but a day goes by where someone comments on how much I'm eating. I don't pass up the chance to throw any additions in if they're offered. I'm a sucker for dessert.
I'm finding the usual nuts, corn but also the veggie I eat, blueberries in the stool.
Dolf
Moderator
Ram you need to check out my video from Seth Feroce I posted called Chicken and Rice Motherfuckers. Pay close attention around the 9min 30sec point. Basically you need to go to eating easily digested foods for a few weeks, and then add in other things here and there to see how you respond. Another thing is track your calories very closely. Know exactly how many grams of protein, carbs, and fats you take in everyday. Keep a log and notes on how you feel and weight loss or gains. Can you tell me exactly how many macros you eat each day? I can.
https://musclegurus.to/forum/training-nutrition-and-diet/diet-and-nutrition/123650-chicken-and-rice-motherfuckers
Mister A
Guest
Honestly, RAM, to me it looks like you're eating mostly junk. All that dairy. I'm not lactose intolerant or anything, but a glass of milk will fuck my digestion up for the entire day. I only know that however, because of the simplicity of my diet overall. My foods are so easy to digest, absorb and eliminate that when I eat something not in my meal plan - I can feel the effects of it.
I mean that first meal - I highly doubt you're done digesting it fully until about bed time. That calorie builders bar, whatever that is, sounds like a bunch of chemicals your body is going to recognize as poison. 1200 calorie steak burrito with guacamole: dude, that shit probably takes you 24 hours to digest. You're talking 80 grams of fat probably. Add that on top of everything else you're trying to digest and it's a lot like setting up a newspaper stand inside a burning building. This 800 calorie protein shake sounds like it's loaded with fat and or carbs. Just another thing for your body to struggle to digest.
I'm 240 and none of my meals are over 500 calories.
You can eat all the food in the world, if your body isn't digesting, absorbing and eliminating it properly, you're not going to benefit from it. I'm willing to bet you don't need to eat dirty calories to put on muscle. You just need to eat the right kinds of foods consistently and over a period of time.
If you gain .5 pounds of muscle a month for 2 years, you will look completely different. Your goal should not be to add a pound of muscle a week. Nobody can do that! We need to simplify your meal plan and get your body digesting food properly again. I don't use a probiotic, personally. I haven't been able to find enough research to support them. I think eating clean and optimizing your digestion, absorption and elimination is the best way to create a stable and optimal bacterial environment in your gut.
I get what you're saying, but you were also stating in your initial post that a person needs more calories. calories aren't the problem with my diet is what you're saying. based of your original post I need to eat more calories.
where are you saying grams of fat matter? nothing I eat takes long to digest, I see it.
what's in a burrito? tortilla, rice, beans, steak, cheese, sour cream, avocados.
Mister A
Guest
My initial post wasn't directed at you. It was more of a blanket summary of what keeps people from achieving the size they want. Most people just can't eat that much food. I'm not questioning whether you can eat 4-5000 calories. I'm questioning the quality of your calories.
What are your macros? I think in order to really do this right you need to be tracking your macros and calories daily and be able to know what they are so you can make adjustments when needed. Otherwise you're really just winging it.
You're saying you don't think anything you eat takes long to digest? I'm saying the complete opposite. Let me know if I should explain that a little better.
Fats are the slowest digesting macronutrient. There are 9 calories per every gram of fat as opposed to 4 calories per gram of carbs and protein. The body takes more effort and time to digest fat. Theres a lot of science behind that.
A burrito is going to be very high in fat given those ingredients. It's going to take your body quite awhile to break down a meal like that.
I'd personally like to see you eating a simpler and cleaner menu. I'd like to see what your body does with 3000 clean calories that are being digested between meals rather than taking all day to digest.
I'm not an expert on nutrition, but the things I pointed out seem like deficiencies in your game plan and I'm sure we could find a way to improve this with the help of everyone here.
Dolf
Moderator
X2 Grizz
Ram as a former or so called hard gainer myself I was 6'2" 155lbs and am now 218lbs, and been as high as 232lbs I can personally atest to how benificial it is simplifying your diet. I used to eat just like you and plateaued. I sat down figured out my caloric needs and macros. Divided it by 6 and set up all 6 of my meals to equal 1/6th of total needs. I too don't use a digestive enzyme, but I only eat easily digestible foods. Chicken breast, 99/1 turkey, white rice, oats, egg whites, whole eggs, spinich, asparagus, and broccoli. That's it bro! It's not sexy it's not special, but it works. I have a cheat day once per week. You just have to get creative with sauces and seasoning to change up the taste. Sometimes I'll get blocks of frozen creamed spinich and put half a block over my rice for a change. I think once you get yourself balanced out you can add things here or there and see how your body redponds.
Note on cheat days
Cheat days do not mean you drink a 12 pack of soda! Eat a whole box of cookies! Eat an entire cheese cake! Eat a whole pack of Hershey kisses! Cheat day means you eat steak, potatoes, gravy, and corn cob. If you want a slice cheese cake afterwards then by all means, but not the entire fucking cake! If you want McDonalds for lunch then go ahead. If you want eggs, bacon, and hashbrowns for breakfast do it. I see too many people use the term cheat day as an excuse to engorge on sugar filled processed foods, and that's a no go imo!
i will say this. , i have winged it for years. and when i looked over my pics for the last 3 years here , guess what ????? nothing changed ,,except a little more bf on stomach and a little less....my pics look impressive for a 50 year old. but guess what it doesnt chage the fact. that yes im jacked. (or lets say i look good for 50) thats a better term ... well i actually started caring watching trying to calculate my diet. so i can loose that bf and put back on the muscle. ...and ill tell you what honestly. , if you can get this right , you drive you manipulate where you want to go ...BOTTOM LINE. i do not eat dirty no more. , i will not stop anywhere for a quick , meal meaning BK , OR KFC OR TACO BELL no. no way im not saying i wont stop at the local.diner , i will but i know the cook. , or at a subway. but this right now is the most hardest thing i ever encountered with aas. ... its not only the ## but how clean are they. ect. honestly I FEEL LIKE A NEWBE. AND I AM.WITH DIET.
Dolf
Moderator
That's right ram!
Doing the same thing over and over yet expecting a different result is not how you go about it brotha. Let's simplify your diet, and target certain foods and macro ratios and see what happens. You gotta be willing to change to be able to grow. That's in size (weight) and life brotha. Give it 12 weeks and lets see what happens. I'm willing to bet you'll be pleased for making the change...
</p><p>Most of what you say works great for the majority of people who can gain weight on 3000-4000 calories a day. Dairy, whole milk in particular is an excellent way to add calories and fat. fat is essential in gaining especially for someone who struggles. your "junk food" theory is good for someone who doesn't have to eat dirty calories to get more. there is a lot of science in it that you are correct. but when it's all boiled down it comes down to calorie in and calories burned. If i wasn't hitting the gym and eating 3000-4000 calories i still wouldn't get fat. I tried many years ago to gain weight this way. the only way i could add was by doing it in muscle. </p><p>I am not saying this information isn't all valuable, but it isn't universal. 5 years ago I was making good natural gains. I spent 6 months with a dietitian. she had be record meals for a week which i did. she had me cut out my cheat meals, drop the builders bars. cut out sour cream on the burrito, and add more one more breakfast (I chose that nasty shit called cottage cheese). I stopped gaining. I took a few month off the bulk and went back too it. I hit the 5000 calorie mark with my meal tracker for 30 days i gained and then plateaued. I dropped to 3000-4000 and maintained after going another month at 5000 with no increase. I gain .5 pounds of muscle a month. I have done this a while now. I am not complaining about that. many people who gain well can do a cycle and gain 20 pounds in 12-20 weeks. I am lucky to keep 5. genetics play a HUGE role. maybe i just don't have what it takes to be an elite, but the reason this topic gets to me is because I change what i am doing often and work my ass off to get bigger. I am slowly getting there, but there is no one way that works for everyone. and the thought that "do the same think and expect different results" has to be looked at two ways.</p><p>1. If I am eating one way and gaining i would expect to continue to gain eating that way. -NO I need to change what i am doing to keep getting what i am getting. The same thing goes for building muscle. If do the same routine and gain muscle , I will have to change my routine to keep changing. so my thought process here is that I have to do something different to get the same result.</p><p>2. when what i am doing stops working then I will change what I am doing. if i keep doing it and it isn't working then i change. lets not forget that what i was doing before worked so many will expect it to work again. NOT THE CASE.</p><p>sorry for the rant, but for whatever reason this has been turning gears in my head for two days now.</p><p> </p>Mister A said: