Esters

subzeronation

New member

Short, medium or long esters?


When planning a cycle which do you prefer to base your cycle combination on? and why?


A popular answer is going to be it depends but I personally would be more interested in something more specific than that.

 

JARHEAD2

Member

I prefer short ester cycles. Although it requires more pinning, I believe it helps levels to remain more stable. I also prefer everyday pinning, but at the least every other day.

 

subzeronation

New member

That's interesting about stable levels because the opposite is actually true. I know this is very impractical but if you had daily blood levels taken you would see this for yourself. The short esters create a surge of hormone release with a quicker fall off. This makes longer esters a better choice if your focus is stabilizing blood hormone levels.

 

blastthru23

Moderator

I use short esters on cycle, and never blended compounds. The reason for this is that I like to be able to manipulate doses of any compound for any reason without having to wait for the desired effect. It gets cumbersome pinning daily, but I have a good, well established rotation.

I use long esters while cruising. The reason  this is that I'm running such a low dose, and will keep it that way throughout, that negative sides will almost non existent. This, no need to adjust up or down with respect to dose. Running longs gives me a break from every day pinning as well. 

 

JARHEAD2

Member

I can agree with that depending pinning schedule. If I am using long esters, I will pin twice a week. I feel that by doing that I may have more than the targeted dose in my bloods during a small amount of time, but I'm avoiding have the opposite affect. I also agree with the short esters & that is why I prefer to pin everyday. IMO, & that's not worth much :), I can keep my levels more stable & have greater control over doses. 

 

subzeronation

New member

While I can agree that you can have greater control over your dosing in PEAK levels with a shorter ester you end up having a lot less control over your blood serum levels from a stability standpoint regardless of your pinning schedule. Just a few hours in difference in your pinning schedule will have an impact of serum levels. Longer esters are more lenient. The longer the half life the less peaks or valleys you will have in your serum levels.

Here is a poor example- A short easter is like placing a frying pan on high heat to get to temperature , then placing it in ice cold water, and then placing it back on high heat to reheat. A longer ester is placing the frying on medium heat to reach temperature, then removing the pan and setting it aside on the stove top to cool, and then placing it back on medium heat to reheat.

Which one has a more stable temperature over time?

If a shorter ester is working for you and is the basis for planning your cycles than go for it. But if blood serum level stability is the focus than the longer the half life of the ester is a better route to go.

 

subzeronation

New member

I prefer longer esters. I am partial to primobolan depot on any cycle so I attempt to maintain my dosing schedules centered around the medium ester. I do jump start or taper down cycles with ace or prop. 

In the passed I have focused on the shorter ester if it is a new experience like tren or nandrolone just in case my body had a negative reaction. Once I gained experience with a shorter I go with the longer version. Trestolone being the exception. I am not considering using the decanoate version of this steroid yet.

I actually pin more frequently than most people will recommend. Three times per week with ethanate or cyp because when I include the primobolan over 600mg/wk I prefer to reduce the volume of each injection. I like 1.5-3ml per injection. Anything over that reduces the injection sites available. I prefer to backload and use a mixed syringe. Multiple injections on any given day are not my style and I plan my cycle to avoid them as much as possible.

 

blastthru23

Moderator

I have heard of people pinning longs on an eod protocol, and that makes sense intuitively at least. And I have somewhat given it consideration, but I am attached to greater flexibility that shorts offer. 

This off topic, but, may as well ask, and perhaps a different thread may be better if needed, but any ways. I'm going to run MENT this fall, and would love to hear what your experience was with it. Some say their e2 goes haywire, while others don't seem to have that experience. Some recommended 50mg per day, others recommen higher (75-100), and heard of 25-35mg per day. I'm planning on running it for 8 weeks followed by other stacks to complete the cycle. I'll post that later in a different thread.

 

strong

Member

It Depends: )

I use both long and short.  This winter I will do a test E and Deca cycle. I see no reason to be playing with doses and will make a straight forward cycle and stick with it. I don't mind Needles but it sure is easier to pin twice a week than 7 times a week.

One of my best cycles was Sust,NPP and Var. (short esters) However, I do feel Sust is misunderstood by most. I felt it was best pinned EOD but that was just what worked for me. Personally, I will not use Sust. again.

I got into short esters using Tren. I have always learned, You don't want to start a Tren cycle and not be able to handle the sides and have the sides attached to a long ester. Since then I have always liked shorts, Prop being my favorite compound. Most say that prop. will not give the bloating effect that a long ester will. I have seen nothing to back that statement up personally... Myself, I guess I just like the way short esters hit and I tend to run shorter cycles...

 

subzeronation

New member

The math says that injecting less often with more volume, based on the ester half life, provides better peak levels but without going with high concentration gear it makes the volume required virtually impossible. lol

 

strong

Member

+2 and x2 on pinning long esters more frequently with less volume.  I am planning to add Primo to my list. I have heard nothing but good things from SemperFi and I saw a few things from you. I have done my research and feel it will be good at lower doses for me on a cut cycle.

 

strong

Member

High concentrate gear kills me. My body cant handle EO. Most high MG compounds have EO if not all..... You want to talk Volume. Just do a prop, tren, mast cycle.... Nightmare..

 

subzeronation

New member

The concept of sust was a good idea but ended up being a pharmaceutical bust. I don't see it necessary on any cycle but some swear by it. It's like cars- some like the new and sporty and some like pure muscle.

Shorter cycles will absolutely make a difference. Thanks for pointing that out!

 
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